Monday, February 26, 2001

Vladan Batic, Serbian minister of justice

Bread and prisons

Vladan Batic

One of the promises of the Democratic Opposition of Serbia (DOS) during the election campaign was an independent judiciary system and a decisive fight against corruption and crime was. Judging by the personnel changes within the judiciary system and the increase in the workload of the police and courts, Serbian Justice Minister Vladan Batic is very determined to fulfill the given promise. Mr. Batic even found time a little time in his busy schedule for this interview. Important notice: this interview was conducted before the arrest of former State Security Service chief Radomir Markovic.

FS: Socialist Party of Serbia (SPS) and Yugoslav Left (JUL) supporters have been protesting in front of the Serbian Government building the past few days demanding the retraction of the Amnesty Act and the release of Dragoljub Milanovic. Does this pressure you and the Serbian Government?

I don't feel this as particular pressure since the number of demonstrators, their make-up and mental state is the best proof of the SPS and JUL power at the moment. They are fading parties, and such demonstrations and pressures are senseless. I don't understand their protest for Dragoljub Milanovic. His case is in the jurisdiction of the courts, and not SPS and JUL. I also don't understand why they are holding demonstrations in front of the Serbian Government when they are protesting the Amnesty Act, which is to be passed by the Yugoslav Federal Parliament. It only shows that SPS and JUL have completely lost their bearing.

FS: How do you find the transferred iconography of the protests prior to the October 5, 2000 events, i.e. the whistles, walks, announcements of daily demonstrations until demands are met?

They live in another Serbia. What they are doing has nothing to do with reality. There are certain mentally troubled people, and if they are the trustworthy ones in SPS and JUL then it is the best proof of the circumstances within those parties. However, since numerous machinations and felonies by former government officials will be revealed in the following weeks, I think that they will soon loose their will to protest when their few remaining supporters see what their leaders did.

FS: The dismissal of old and appointment of new judges passed without criticism from members of the former regime as well as G17 Plus. Is there any basis to doubt the expertise and competence of the newly appointed judges?

There is no foundation for such thought, this is the best personnel that we could offer. The people from the former regime disapprove because they had their confidants, supporters and servants within the justice department, and they are left without them. The initiation of criminal cases, whose number will increase, proves that we are on the right track. Just look at the qualities of newly appointed Supreme Court President Mrs. Leposava Karamarkovic. Serbia could not have offered a better person for the position, neither from an expert nor moral aspect. Branislav Ivkovic, SPS caucus leader in the Serbian Parliament congratulated Mrs. Karamarkovic on her appointment and immediately refuted himself for early criticism.

FS: There will be to regaining confidence in the courts until members of the former regime who worked against the state and people are brought to justice. Mihalj Kertes and Miodrag Zecevic have been apprehended, and then released. Does this mean that our justice system is not prepared for serious trials?

Our courts are completely prepared for all trials. I don't want to prejudge court decisions, no is it my job to arrest or try, but the public will pass judgement on the matter in a few days. This problem of what happened to Kertes and Zecevic happened before the personnel changes in the justice system, primarily in Belgrade. They were remnants of the past that will soon be completely eliminated.

FS: What will happen to the sentence passed against Bill Clinton, Hubert Vedrine, Robin Cook, Javier Solana, and other western leaders, sentenced to 20 years in prison for war crimes committed against our country. Are these sentences valid?

That judicial farce is the best proof of the travesties carried out during the former regime. The case has no connection with reality and must be revised. I have nothing against trying direct crime participators. I myself have filed charges against NATO aviation commanders for war crimes committed during the bombing, but that has nothing to do with the judicial farces that were conducted against western head of state and NATO officials.

FS: Will domestic courts deal in war crimes or will the entire issue be yielded to the Hague Tribunal?

The anathema cast on the entire people must be removed. We have no reason to carry the mortgage of a war crime people because of a few individuals who committed those crimes in our name. There are legal options for trying Yugoslav citizens for war crimes before our courts, since the FRY Penal Code recognizes a range of war crimes. Our courts can try all the cases being heard before the Hague, i.e. genocide, war crimes, crimes against humanity, and civilian war victims. Therefore all the preconditions are fulfilled for trying the suspects in our courtrooms. It is my opinion that this should be done because it will show another side of the Serbian people, a side that will not pardon war criminals, regardless of whom they might be. I think that all war criminals should be tried, eve if they are our brothers.

FS: You are preparing a draft law for cooperation with the Hague Tribunal, with Federal Justice Minister Momcilo Grubac. When will this law be find itself in Parliament and what are its chief points?

Mr. Grubac has still not publicized the composition of the work group that is to prepare the draft law, and it is still not certain who will participate in its work. It is still not even obvious whether political figures will participate, or whether it will consist solely of legal experts. I hope that the work group will start its work soon and that it will soon come out with a draft law on cooperation with the Hague Tribunal. However, to be honest, I think that there will be obstacles taking into consideration the constitution of the Federal Government and Parliament, and the Socialist People's Party (SNP) opposition to the fundamental article of this potential law - extradition. Without extradition this law is useless, since we have already established all other direct and indirect means of cooperation. The aim of the entire issue is that he have a legal void regarding extradition to the International Crime Tribunal in the Hague, and I assume that this law makes sense only if it includes extradition.

FS: Is the Hague Tribunal equally just for all the former Yugoslav Republics, having in mind the Mirko Norac case in Croatia?

We have a psychological relation towards the Hague Tribunal creating a bitter taste, especially when the possibility was raised for Norac to be tried in Croatia, instead of the Hague. It created doubts and dilemmas regarding selective justice, because the justice balances should be equal for all. I think this case is an award for Croatia's cooperation with the Hague Tribunal. On the other hand, I told Carla Del Ponte that there would be no serious advances if she does not publicly accuse the leaders of the Kosovo Liberation Army for the horrible crimes committed against Serbs in Kosovo and Metohia. This would show that all are equal before the Hague Tribunal and that everyone who committed crimes must face the consequences. Only a small portion of the public is aware that the Hague Tribunal's jurisdiction is until June 1999. Most of the crimes were committed after ethnic Albanians returned to Kosovo, i.e. after the NATO bombardment and after June 1999. Carla Del Ponte has raised the question of extending the time period jurisdiction of the Tribunal with the UN Security Council to crimes committed later, which would include the possibility of trying ethnic Albanian extremists and terrorists and the latest crimes near Podujevo and Lucane.

FS: Will the ombudsman institution be included in the local judiciary system?

It most likely will, since it was one of the promises made by the Democratic Opposition of Serbia during the election campaign. This will be a new institution in our circumstances so there is a certain reserve and fright, but I think it is the proper thing and that there would be visible effect in government control.

FS: How will corruption of the judiciary be dealt with?

In the following days the Republic Parliament will pass a law against corruption and organized crime. Corruption must be penalized as an individual crime, especially government and judiciary corruption. It will therefore be rigorously sanctioned. Corruption will also be repressed through a different selection of judiciary administrators and elevating the judiciary level, creating conditions for judges to be free and independent, which includes bettering their financial status. In a nutshell: better financial status, better selection and rigorous corruption penalties.

FS: The Serbian Government is not being given much time, as the public has been informed for blaming the former regime. When will the concrete results of the new democratic government be felt?

None of us promised prosperity, milk and honey. I think that all reasonable and goodwill Serbian people are aware of the fact that nothing can be achieved overnight. People have to issues they think of: one is improving their living standards and the second is of seeing those who have devastated their lives and made their families, country and people miserable behind bars. The ancient roman phrase "bread and games" can be converted to "bread and jail", with respect to the majority opinion in Serbia. Bread for the people, jail for those who have brought them to the point where they long for bread. There are no more waiting lines for bread, sugar, oil, milk, gasoline, there are no more black market foreign currency dealers, no more street vendors. Certain thing are moving along, but it is unrealistic to expect everything to be swift. We will take step by step in order to improve the living standard, revitalize the economy and establish a legal state. Spectacular moves should not be expected because we do not have a magic wand. We need credits, investments and foreign arrangements, we need to revive the legal state and create confidence. It is a unappreciated job, but we have the will and the Government is working hard. I think the results, not spectacular but obvious will be visible very soon.

FS: The Social Democratic Union (SDU) youth petitioned the legalization of homosexual marriages. Being Justice Minister, what is your opinion of this initiative?

I think it is unfitting for out living environment and the existing state of mind within our people. I spoke with [SDU President] Zarko Korac and he himself was surprised that his youth had made such a proposal, so I think that the initiative will not meet with approval. We are still a conservative nation with certain parameters, frames of thought and a majority state of mind. I think it is still too early to address the issue.

FS: One might get the impression that you are hated among members of the former regime. What is the reason?

It is obvious that a clear message, sharp word, justice and truth are a great nuisance to them. They had created a system of deranged values, and now they fear what might be said in court, but everything will be revealed - and soon. Be patient, there will be great and interesting events in the next few days in court. Many people within the former government carried out Slobodan Milosevic's orders and were involved in different criminal acts. He was Ali Baba, and they were his thieves. Now they all must face justice. The loop is closing around Slobodan Milosevic.

FS: Will Slobodan Milosevic be tried in our courts for illegal development in Dedinje, embezzlement or war crimes and crimes against humanity? Is there any concrete evidence against him for any of these offenses?

That is a question for the police, prosecutor and court. In any case, evidence is being gathered and there are many elements confirming that he committed many offenses. Nevertheless, he was the master of life and death, and his close associates will be the best witnesses.

FS: So justice is slow but within range?

Absolutely. The inscription on the statue of the goddess Justicia, with her eyes tied, carrying a sword in one hand and a balances in the other, reads: "Fiat justicia ne pereat mundus" [Let justice be done lest the world perish]. We need that.

Bojan Bozic

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